Rebecca: Why on earth did you quit being a standup comic? I know, you had to keep a roof over The Duchess & the Princess & comedy doesn't pay peanuts, still your humor has done wonders to resuscitate all those Dead White Guys.
Wayne: In the early 90s the comedy club boom ended with a thud. 80% of the clubs in the country closed in the 6 months after I moved to L.A. it was a bad time to be an average looking white guy with a reasonably clever act but no “hook.” It was a good run & I don't regret a minute of it.
Rebecca: What is a Philistine, what makes an author or a book a Classic, & how did you choose?
Wayne: Well, technically, the Philistines were a tribe in the ancient middle east (Goliath was their poster child). When they conquered Israel they sacked the temple & destroyed a lot of the written works—they weren't exactly art lovers. The word has come to be used by art snobs to imply anyone with middle–brow tastes who doesn't “get” avant garde art. That being said, I use the term for myself (mostly) jokingly -- since I don't have a formal college education & didn't really know much about a lot of these books, I was coming to it as a middle-class, middle-brow, middle-aged (clowns to the left of me -- jokers to the right -- here I am stuck in the middle with you) average guy -- just another Philistine.
What makes a classic? Well, it has to stand the test of time, obviously. Something that has been read over & over again by at least two generations & still enlightens, entertains or enrages is a classic.
As to how I selected them -- in typical Philistine fashion -- I already was collecting the Classic Club books...someone had determined they were classics, I had them at hand so they were pre-selected. I just worked my way through the shelf. I intentionally (except, as you know Robinson Crusoe) left out most of the novels, as I was an avid novel reader already & knew most of the authors. I really focused on people I didn't know well or, like Bret Harte, even at all.
Wayne: Plutarch was a big nut for me to crack. First of all, the edition I read was something like 1230 pages long -- & it was the abridged version. The real translated works run for 10 volumes or more. All written with a stick, mind you. This was not a casual endeavor to create or to read. He also has this awesome reputation -- in the good old fashioned biblical sense of the word -- he was one of the few pagans that the Catholic church said was such a good guy he was going to heaven despite not being Christian.
This was pretty big of them at a time when they were burning & defenestrating (don't you love that word!) people for pretty much the same reason. He wrote history about people I couldn't even pronounce, let alone recall. It was one of the more pleasant surprises of my reading -- I loved it. Well written history is still story telling, & it's fascinating stuff. Also it put paid to the idea that the Greeks & the Romans were some kind of superhumans, better than the rest of us. Not only were they human but a lot of them were gangsters & punks. But let me tell you -- that was some tough slogging to get to the good stuff. You try to pronounce Thucidydes the son of Athromac five times fast.
Rebecca: So many of the Classics are written in old, old English, you did a good job of distilling all that musty, arcane language into modern expressions. I like that you include passages from each book you read that you felt had impact. Any clues as to how we can also do that?
Wayne: Well, those of us that grew up with the King James Bible have an advantage. We're used to all the “thees” & “thous” & “eths”. As to how “you” can do it -- a lot of these books are in modern English translations now. Don't forget I had to cite 100 year old translations to avoid copyright problems (gotta love public domain). There are newer, probably better editions out there. There are some excellent internet sites. Also, take it in small bites. Montaigne said, “Some books are meant to be nibbled, some to be chewed, some to be digested.” You knew I'd get a Montaigne quote in there somewhere, didn't you?
Rebecca: I came up in the last paroxysms (WT: Good word!) of a dying empire, when my brothers would bring home from school such Classics as Daniel Defoe's Robinson Crusoe) which had been a bestseller since it was published in 1719. Why would you hesitate to encourage your youngsters to read this prototypical adventure story?
Wayne: Robinson Crusoe gave me all kinds of liberal guilt & what the Yiddish call tsuris. It is the prototypical adventure story -- & still a darned good one. I enjoyed it on that level. The reason it gives me fits is its 17th century view of the world, as anyone who isn't white, Christian or English is inherently inferior. I think you should be old enough to think about these things before tackling the book, or at least talk it over with someone. I think one of the reasons past generations have some of the attitudes they do about race, etc., is that they read these as the way things are -- rather than one person's view of the way things are. Cultural assumptions become norms -- & I'd better stop before I hate myself. In the book, I say that I feel about Robinson Crusoe the way I feel about Deuce Bigelow, Male Gigolo -- I liked it a lot, but am embarrassed to recommend it to my friends.
Rebecca: Your discussion about essayist John Locke (1690) was deeply anthropological & right on! Why is what this author wrote so long ago important to understand in this day & age?
Wayne: It was really the way he changed the assumptions about people. That we are essentially all human & granted the same rights whether we are Christian, Muslim, Jewish, Whatever -- he took that as a right -- not exactly a universal attitude. If you assume that we all have the same rights then how we govern, work with each other, & raise our kids will change radically from the way Kingdoms in Europe were working at that time. I think that's what a classic is -- it strikes a chord of truth -- this one is still reverberating. Of course, he had the good luck to have Jefferson, Paine, Franklin & the boys do his little experiments far from the throne of England.
Wayne: Wow, I don't know that they have that much in common except that the stories they tell are wildly improbable, horribly violent & really cool. Also the female leads fall in love with the heroes for no apparent reason, which gives all guys hope. The end of the Odyssey is gorier & more violent than anything Arnold ever did!
Rebecca: What's so important about The Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam? (written in the 1400s & translated into English in the 1800s)
Wayne: Want me to get all serious on ya & stuff? First of all, it was the first Persian or Arab (most Englishmen couldn't tell the difference at the time) literature translated for public consumption. Even though the Islamic world was writing & saving culture while our ancestors were living in the Dark Ages, it was one of the first works to show the Empire that there were beautiful things in other cultures. On a personal level, the pure joy it had crosses any Islam/Christian barrier -- if you're in touch with God, you're in touch with God & it's all good, really good. I needed to hear that when I read it.
Rebecca: Who was Bret Harte & why is he considered a Classic?
Wayne: Bret Harte is the poor man's Mark Twain -- & the Richard Bach (Jonathan Livingston Seagull -- remember him?) of his generation -- okay let me explain that one.
He was this Connecticut school teacher who came out to California during the gold rush. He lasted about 5 months teaching kids in the mining camps, then moved to San Francisco & became a reporter. He wrote these wonderful funny, sad, revealing stories about the Gold Rush. The Richard Bach reference comes in where he became world famous on that early work & filthy rich -- got out of California as soon as he could to write “real” books & never wrote anything worth a damn again. He ultimately was famous for being famous -- but his creative output was actually very slight. Good stuff though.
Rebecca: Did you ever end up enjoying Henrik Ibsen's plays?
Wayne: Yes, some of them. Most were just depressing & humorless & WAY too Scandinavian for my taste. I would love to see Patrick Stewart doing Master Builder in New York though. That was probably my favorite -- about a guy getting older & sweating it -- can't imagine why that has any appeal!
Rebecca: Why are there no women writers in the Classics? Didn't The Duchess have something to say about that?
Wayne: Because chicks can't write! Oh did I say that out loud? Seriously -- it was partly cultural -- until relatively recently publication & writing was done by either a) the church or b) the crown. Both had vested interests in controlling what was published. You think it's tough to find a publisher NOW! Anyway -- until 200 years ago a woman who could read, let alone write & then get it published was rarer than a legitimate Democratic candidate. They pick up speed in the 18th century & I think it's safe to say that Jane Austen, Mary Shelley (any chick who can write Frankenstein is okay in my book) Madame De Stael & many, many others suddenly appear. They just didn't make this book. The Duchess (my long suffering wife, Joan) didn't have much to say on the issue. She's an actress so books aren't her area -- film is. She's like the Rainman when it comes to old movies!
Rebecca: On the head of a pin, what can we learn from the Classics that we can't learn from TV?
Wayne: Here's a Philistine's answer for you. Not a darned thing, except that the act of reading allows you to go back at your own pace & reread it at your own pace, whenever you want. That time to think & reflect is what's missing from television. The universal truths that make works “classic” are still true & a lot of good writers are choosing other media to work in. Remember that 90% of everything ever written was pure crap. You have to find the good stuff. TV has only been around 50 years -- & there's been some very good stuff. Also, I'm living proof that anyone with a point of view & computer access can write a book. TV still requires a lot of money to produce. It's all about who controls the means of production -- gee, you can see a lot from on a soap box -- I'll get down now!
Rebecca: Thanks, Wayne, I wish your book many, many readers! By the way, Wayne feels quite lonely in his quest among the Classics & welcomes other readers at his website: www.achismarketing.com
Do catch my review of Wayne Turmel's eventually-to-become classic A Philistine's Journal: An Average Guy Tackles the Classics.
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