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Rebecca :
One of the axioms writers often hear is, “write about what you know.” Your novel, based upon your own experiences while studying in The Holy Land, tells about a young man's struggle to find himself within the protocols of his parents' religion. As you wrote Triopia and The Burden of Excess, was it exciting to relive those months & had you kept a journal?
Bryan :
As student in Brigham Young's Jerusalem Center, I was required to keep a study journal, & it was certainly exciting to relive the moments while writing Triopia. I pursued the remainder of my B.S. at Brigham Young University in Provo, Utah and none those semesters were as memorable as the experience I had in Jerusalem. Not to be cliché, but that semester was the worst & best of times, all at once. Seeing the strife & poverty in the real world & getting to know some of the most talented people I've ever known. Besides, the history is just as intense as the current events. The Middle East excursion was mind boggling & yet, inspiring.
Rebecca :
What would you say to young people who are at odds with the contentment & containment of their parents' faith?
Bryan :
I would have them keep in mind that our religious institutions have billions of dollars at their disposal & they often subsidize higher education. At your vulnerable age, education is probably the most direct path to the kind independence we all yearn for. Whether education comes by the way of your parents or faith-based institutions, stay focused on your most important need. Don't let differing beliefs become the focus & allow it to interfere with your education. Just go with the flow. It's what most religious people do anyway.
Rebecca :
At one point, Daniel's student friends discuss the “righteousness of the rich,” what were they talking about?
Bryan :
Once, my father spoke about this topic. It took some time to understand where he was coming from. His father died when he was nineteen, & at that time my father was one of the poorest in a very poor community. He wanted to serve a Mormon mission in Paris, France, but he learned that only those with families who could financially support the missionary were called by the bishop to serve. I guess my father was affected by this early lesson on service & hierarchy.
I can still remember when, while in the midst of mixed company, my father said, “righteousness is for the wealthy.” It didn't go over well with one of my overly pious friends, but his statement had additional weight, since he had come from poverty & had managed to earn a master's degree from an Ivy League university. He was an unusually dedicated human being. Unfortunately, my father coincidentally died when I was nineteen & I've learned the same lessons on how it can be a struggle to be a good when you don't have any funds.
Rebecca :
During a conversation between the four friends, Kristen avers that women are more spiritual than men. I've heard that a number of times. What did she mean by that?
Bryan :
Kristen genuinely felt that women were more spiritual, & in Saudi, men sometimes feel men are more spiritual. Whichever perspective you hold, young Daniel perceived either position as simple-minded posturing related to the endless ego-isms he continually has to deal with. As an author, I imagined Kristen being sincere in her statement, & young Daniel perceived Kristen canonizing her emotional sixth-sense into a dominant definition of spirituality -- a monopoly of sorts. Frankly, I find their conversation silly, but ninety percent of our conversation with friends & family, & even media conversation, tends to be about our egos. Kristen's posturing was partly playful, but it was also an illustration of her personal insecurity & exemplified the state of endless, posturing insecurity we all must endure.
Rebecca :
One of Daniel's epiphanies is about his sense of belonging -- the creation of one's own spiritual path. Could you expand on that?
Bryan :
The entire book is dedicated to Daniel's attempt to define himself in the spectrum of spirituality. Daniels discovers himself in relation to his own country, his family, his friends, his understanding of who he is in relation to the world around him. In one word, the epiphany is Triopia. Through his journey in the cradle of civilization, Daniel begins to see the world Triopically. Simply said, Triopia is the commonality between these various perspectives.
Rebecca :
Daniel often sees, through the windows of the university, the puffs of tear gas in Jerusalem. With the escalation of tensions between Palestinians & Israelis, are students still going to Jerusalem to study?
Bryan :
Brigham Young's Jerusalem Center closed the student program about two years ago. I understand BYU maintains a skeleton crew & some activities. Keep in mind that when I was there, the Palestinians were only throwing rocks. Now the conflict has escalated with suicide bombing, which have certainly intensified the risk to the Center.
Rebecca :
Is there an inherent incompatibility between faith & science?
Bryan :
Definitely not. You gotta have both to live life in Technicolor. Otherwise life is just boring black & white drudgery. Whether its faith or science, having purely one perspective is like having one eye. It's a limited perspective.
Rebecca :
While Daniel's studies involved an immersion into the Scriptures to learn more about early Judaism & Christianity, the study of Islam was ignored. Why was that?
Bryan :
Islam is not being ignored, just dealt with indirectly. Islam is similar to
Christianity & Judaism in terms of unity, prayer, fasting, morality, keeping the Sabbath day holy & other commonalities. Orthodoxy & Unity are words young Daniel uses to summarize these commonalities. As the author of Triopia, I intentionally wanted the reader to look into a mirror of criticism rather than point fingers at some exotic religion. The conflict is not necessarily with Islam. The conflict is with any kind of religious nationalism. Triopia is a powerful rejection of religious-political romanticism; in other words, the argument for separation of church & state. If Islam had been dealt with directly, the message would have been watered down by our own biases & bigotries. Secondly, Muslims are hypersensitive to Western criticism. Be assured the average Islamic reader will be able to read be between the lines & feel the same conflict young Daniel feels between traditional & modern culture, & better understand the traditional roots of Islam.
Rebecca :
In Triopia and The Burden of Excess you write a lot about racism & bigotry; nationalism & tribalism. In the Aftermath of 9/11, what ways do you think your thoughts about nationalism & tribalism have changed?
Bryan :
The conflicts I wrote about were a prophetic prelude to September 11. Trying to resolve these conflicts is like trying to piece a puzzle together. We all want peace, but in different ways. Sadly, September 11 only reconfirms my thoughts on nationalism, racism, tribalism & bigotry. Even more sadly, the problem will intensify before it gets better. I am concerned about the void of vision needed to resolve these continuing conflicts. Eventually, Triopia will fill this void. It's just a matter of time.
Rebecca :
Have the friendships you made during those six months, become lifelong ones & why would you recommend a six month sojourn in a strange land to study the roots of one's faith to a young questioner?
Bryan :
The friendships that formed during this travel did become lifelong friendships. I continue to keep in touch even though we are spread, seemingly, throughout the world. The main reason I recommend a six-month sojourn in a strange land is to learn about the goodness of our own home. It's kind of like Dorothy in The Wizard of Oz. When she finally returns, she knows “there's no place like home.” Many Americans don't appreciate how good it is here in the U.S., or what it is that makes the U.S. a good place. They don't fully realize our system. A trip in a foreign land helps us understand. Secondly, I recommend extended travel just for the chance of getting to know new friends. Traveling & study has a way of teaching self-discovery & creating new intimacies.
Rebecca :
Of all the places you visited during your pilgrimage, which remains the most powerful in your memory & why?
Bryan :
There were so many sites that I enjoyed visiting. Karnak, Dor, The Valley of
the Kings. But the site that impacted me the most was seeing the literal location of ancient Zion. As a Mormon, I was raised with songs & rituals adulating that ancient place of David. I was surprised to see how small & dirty it was. The nearby fields & natural fortress had disappeared. There were some ruins, but it was mostly a small-impoverished Palestinian neighborhood. Utah has Zion's Bank, Zion's National Park & Zion everything else. Truly, historic Zion lasted for only a brief moment in time, & that realization & disappointment seemed like crushing loss of innocence. The meaning of all the songs & rituals seemed to take on a new meaning. I guess you can say I've taken on more of an ecological perspective & concern. I find it disturbing how the mixture of time & humanity self-destroys what we love & romanticize.
Rebecca :
Thank you, Bryan, for taking the time out of your busy life, to answer my questions. Is there anything else you would like to say?
Bryan :
Early in Triopia and The Burden of Excess, Anthony & Daniel talk about the difference between a tribe & nation. As the story progresses, each reader should be identifying the three passages into nationhood. At first, Daniel
just happen-chances on the first passage. The remaining two rites-of-passage, are part of Daniel's self-discovery. After reading Triopia, I hope each reader sits back & asks that question again & tries to come up with a personal answer.
Thank you for the excellent interview. You have penetrating, journalistic perception. I hope we can have more discussions in the future.
Rebecca :
Do catch my review of Bryan Richards' Triopia and The Burden of Excess
Amazon's Price is: $18.95
Rebecca Brown
(Published March 31, 2002)
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